Healing Lyme, POTs, Sensory Sensitivities, skin conditions & so much more with Kimberly Harter

00:00:00 Kimberly: I want to share my story. I want other people to know that you can be in a place where you think you're going to die, that there's no way out of this to be able to become a whitewater rock guy.

00:00:18 Chazmith: Welcome to Our Power Is Within Podcast. I'm your host Chazmith, and my mission for this podcast is to inspire you to take your power back and to realize that you are the healer that you have been looking for all along. I believe that we are all capable of healing in mind, in body, and in soul. If you're new to the podcast, welcome, and if you've been tuned in for a while now and find value in this podcast, please consider leaving a five-star review on Apple or my website ourpoweriswithin.com. Other ways that you can support this podcast are leaving a small donation by clicking the link Support This Podcast in the show notes and or share your favorite episode on social media and tag me.

00:01:02 Chazmith: So our guest today is Kimberly Harder. And today we talk about all things healing. Go figure. So Kimberly shares her testimonial story with us. Some of what didn't work, but mostly what did work. And while her healing journey is incredibly complex, as many of us can relate, there are a few things that really stood out for her that we focus on discussing in today's episode, which are brain retraining, cold exposure, and breath work. I love how much I learned from Kimberly during this chat today and I hope that you have some fun takeaways as well. So please enjoy.

00:01:54 Chazmith: All right, Kimberly, thank you so much for being here with me today. 

00:01:59 Kimberly: Thank you for having me.

00:02:01 Chazmith: Yeah. So for everybody who is going to be tuned in listening to this, fun fact, Kimberly and I are actually meeting for our second time. because the first time we were having massive technical difficulties and we got interrupted via the computer recording just completely freezing like five times. We spent hours attempting to record our last interview And then we got cut off and then we were just like, all right, we're done. And here we are several months later, finally meeting again to try this out one more time.

00:02:46 Kimberly: It's going to go great today.

00:02:49 Chazmith: It is. It is. Exactly. I know. I'm really proud of us, though, for even putting in so much effort last time. I thought about it later. I'm like, wow, we were really committed. We kept giving it opportunity after opportunity after opportunity. We just kept going back. I'm like, we can do this. The computer just kept saying, not today.

00:03:08 Kimberly: No, we're like, okay, we got to do this again. And that's okay. It's meant to be.

00:03:12 Chazmith: Yeah, exactly. Okay, so it was just meant to be today for some reason, because there's going to be something in this conversation that speaks to somebody who's listening on a different level today. So Kimberly, let's go ahead and start out with letting you have the floor to share with us briefly on what you have healed from or what you are still healing from.

00:03:36 Kimberly: Yeah. So I had over a decade of severe chronic illnesses with diagnosis of Lyme disease and mold toxicity were the biggest ones. I also had PoTS and I had multiple chemical sensitivities. I had sensory processing disorders, I had massive skin problems going on of all different kinds, parasites, and heavy metals, and the list goes on and on and on for the amount of things that I experienced heavily for over a decade. And with the thought at the point that I was at where I was so low in weight, not digesting food, that I probably would never get out of it. So that was where I was at, at the lowest point in time. 

00:04:23 Chazmith: Where are you at today? 

00:04:24 Kimberly: Today, I'm in a very different situation. To get myself out of where I was at, I became a whitewater raft guide and totally removed myself from the situation that I was in. And now I am thriving and living life and just living as the average healthy human would live. So I don't say those terms loosely because I don't like using specific labels for things, but that is my reality now. So yeah, it's a very different reality than it was before.

00:04:53 Chazmith: Yeah, that's amazing. And just for like a frame of reference, when did you kind of feel at your lowest, like in terms of timeframe, years perhaps, the year perhaps?

00:05:05 Kimberly: Yeah, so it was actually, well, 2017, I had just finished a antifungal IV treatment, which literally almost killed me. And I was at that point really not digesting food, like talking about going on a feeding tube and was 25 to 30 pounds less than I am now and barely able to get myself to the bathroom, let alone like cook my own meals or even filling up the bathtub and getting in the bathtub was something I had help with, so I was pretty much full-time needed somebody to help me with everything. And then a second version of that happened after I had stem cell therapy and I went like way, way, way, way down after that and ended up living in a dark bedroom, like extreme sensory processing, light sensitivity, sound sensitivity, movement sensitivity, living in my noise-canceling headphones and my dark sunglasses, blinds closed all the time, trying to play cards with my mom, where the light was so dim that we couldn't even see the difference between the black cards and the red cards. And so those were the two lowest points in my journey. There were many, but those were the two key ones.

00:06:28 Chazmith: And you said that second point was from stem cell therapy.

00:06:32 Kimberly: Yeah. So it's the stem cell therapy is like, there's so many different thoughts around stem cells and I have, like created my own version of the thoughts around them. So I was told that I would go into neural repair after I had stem cells. And so I was expecting things to get worse, you know, for a while, but my trajectory of what they were saying the trajectory was, was totally off. I also did these stem cells with five other people, and so I kind of have their timelines and their experiences to base off of what I went through as well, since we had the same treatments and protocols over a two-week period. So I was expecting things to get worse, but they got so worse that I was in a dark bedroom with dark sunglasses on, unable to leave the house sometimes for a month at a time. Like going to the grocery store was definitely not an option, you know, like getting in the car was like driving with my hoodie on backwards so that like it was covering my face so that I didn't see the shadows flickering through the windows because like I was afraid of going into a Lyme seizure. The stem cells were entirely through my system out of whack. 

00:07:43 Kimberly: Now, I don't know if they actually did anything or not, because I was doing other things in combination. After the first 100 days, they recommended not to do anything for 100 days after the stem cells. And so I didn't do anything. And then I started my brain retraining up. And then I started breathwork and cold therapy and seeing an astropath for NAAT treatments and a whole bunch of different other things. So there was the people that were in my stem cell group with me, they did not experience like what I experienced where it was 16 months after I had the stem cells that my life started drastically changing and I started having vast improvement. 

00:08:21 Kimberly: So the fact that it was that long afterwards and also, I mean, everybody's timeline for everything's different, but that was like a long span of time after receiving a treatment of any kind. And then also the other things that I was doing in combination with that, I completely pulled myself out of the experience and now I'm no longer experiencing any of those things. And like these other people are still experiencing or did experience for many years, like after those 2018 that I did the stem cells in. And I think it was June 2018.

00:08:52 Chazmith: Nuts. Yeah. Well, yeah, that's just crazy. So yeah, you don't have one way of knowing for sure without a certainty of a doubt one way or another. But to me, based on what you're saying, it sounds like it was really a lot of the other things that played the biggest role or factor if the other people that also did this with you didn't do the same other things as you and didn't get the same results. I don't know if I'd want to feel that bad just to get better.

00:09:18 Kimberly: Yeah. Yeah. And you know what I really think it was, was that the stem cells, like in my mind, I was like, I kind of did this with every treatment, but I did it to a different extent with this one, that this is what I'm going to get better with. And then I had that mindset going in and then I was doing the brain retraining. So I was, I started with DNRS and was doing that. And so I was able to use that momentum of like, this is going to be it to go forward with that. So where that like turned into many different things beyond that and beyond stem cells and all the different things that I like use to visualize and move myself through it. That was like kind of like a start to that. And so I think it kind of like, you know, the placebo effect is something that is seen in 30% of every trial out there. It's like 30% of people, regardless of what it is that they're given, you know, if they're given the pill with nothing in it, you know, the sugar pill or the real treatment are going to get better from it. 

00:10:17 Kimberly: So that's where our mind is so incredibly strong. And so past treatments, I still was very skeptical going into it. I did so many things. I did 15 weeks straight of IV infusions through a chest port that were rocephin and azithromycin and natural antibiotics and vitamin C bags and Myers cocktails and ozone therapy. And I did all of that. And you know, I was weaker after doing all that personally. And then I had like maybe like a boost of, yes, I'm going to be better like after this kind of thing. And I had like a month where I kind of like went out and I like went on a boat with some people and then I like crashed like hardcore and it was just like way worse than it was before. I had started the treatment. 

00:11:00 Kimberly: So I think the mindset around it and like diving into all the little things, there's so much complexity behind this, but like diving into the little reasons why my body had gotten to the place that it was at. And where my mindset had got at, where my emotions were, where my brain patterning and thought patterning was at, like those were all the things that were like the important things. Those were the things that like massively shifted. Yes, supporting the body, supporting the cells, giving yourself continuously the nutrients that you need to get better is just as important. And also the part that I had been missing prior to doing the brain retraining and going inward and really doing meditation and looking at my inner child and like the things that I needed to heal inwardly, that was the main difference that happened. 

00:11:50 Kimberly: So, if I would have done that with the treatments that I had for that 15 weeks of the IV therapies, gone in with that mindset, gone in with the brain retraining, supported myself in all these different ways, like did the shadow work and inner child work, would that have been the treatment that had done it? Would it have been a placebo effect? Or did those treatments actually do something? I don't know. Did they kill some of the bacteria that was in the body from the Lyme? Parasite treatments and things like that. It's probably a little bit of both, but the main thing was the inner work that changed.

00:12:27 Chazmith: And so many people that I've talked to, it's almost like the timing that we do things, right? And how regulated we are because it doesn't matter what treatments we do that are for the body if we're incredibly dysregulated because the body just simply cannot heal in a chronic dysregulated state because it's not supported for healing. And so, we can do treatment after treatment after treatment, but most people, like similarly to what you experienced, end up almost feeling worse. And so, it's almost like we get out on the other side and see how, oh, well, maybe some of those could have helped me if I was more regulated. And then the flip side is, and if I was more regulated and my body was in the right condition to heal, would I still need those treatments?

00:13:13 Kimberly: There's so many layers to it. Like, yeah, some of it's like I hear over and over, you can't heal in the environment that you got sick in. So there's like a degree of that as well that, you know, if like, for instance, I was in a relationship that wasn't serving me when I did those 15 weeks, you know, and I was living with this guy and I was in like a state. I was in Arizona and like I do not do well with the desert. I was at that point like extremely heat intolerant. So if it was 80 plus degrees I was like starting to swell and have like major problems being out in the heat and here I'm in a state that is, you know, over 80 degrees for the majority of the year, you know. And so it was super hot. 

00:13:56 Kimberly: So we had like the blinds closed to keep the house cool and everything. And here I'm basically living in a dungeon. And I've realized since how extremely important it is for me to have big windows in my living environment or to be outside, you know, really like connecting with nature and getting my feet in the ground or, you know, swimming in water. And that was the other thing. There was no water there. And I like trees and water were absent in Arizona. And like, those are hugely balancing things for me. So there were multiple things about the environment I was in there that also I wasn't allowed to heal in the way that was balancing to my system, to my body, my brain.

00:14:32 Chazmith: Yeah, that makes so much sense. So I know from talking to you before that primarily because what we're talking about is that it was when you started brain retraining and then the cold plunges and the breath work, that's when you started really shifting and noticing the true healing happening. That's where it all started to really come together, correct? 

00:14:54 Kimberly: Yes, yes. 

00:14:55 Chazmith: And what timeline did that kind of happen? Did you start them all together? Did you start brain retraining for a period of time and then feel called into experimenting with these other modalities? How did that all unfold?

00:15:09 Kimberly: So I had actually started the DNRS program before I had gotten the stem cells. And I was having a really hard time with it. Reading was extremely hard for me. Language, just being asked what I would like to eat, you know, sometimes like I couldn't even understand that language. So like language was very tough for me. And so very frustrating. So I had to go through it kind of slowly. It took me a long time to like get through, but I did sit down. It was for as many times throughout the day as I could to get through it. And then when I did the stem cells, like a few months after starting that, I stopped doing it for a hundred days. And I just like allowed my body to kind of be in what it was in. ‘Cause that was like the recommendation from the place I was at. 

00:15:52 Kimberly: And then my mom was like, why don't you restart up the DNRS again? You know, cause I was just so mentally down and, you know, just still cognitively having so many issues and everything. And so I started it up. And that's when I started to see the differences happening there was like, I really went into it hardcore, and like, made the decision that even if I could only do it, like for this much of this day, or if I had to change it, and that's where adaption came in hardcore was like, I was trying to find ways that were like more fun, that like aligned with me and like how my brain worked and everything. And that's what I see, like a lot of people with frustration says, in brainwave training, it feels very linear, but there's so many different ways to go about it. 

00:16:40 Kimberly: So I kind of played around with that. And then I also started a mast cell deactivator at that time because my big thing was I was reacting to everything. Like, especially after the stem cells, it was way worse. Like, I was already responding to, I could definitely not walk near the chemical aisle in the grocery store. I had to wear a mask, like this was far before 2020. I had to wear a mask, you know, in the store because I was reacting to people's laundry detergents and perfumes and my face would start breaking out in rashes. So I was on a mast cell deactivator to, like, help balance that out. It was called ketotifen. And then I also was doing NAEG treatments with my acupuncturist, my naturopath. And so that was helping me. I was basically intolerant to like the basic nutrients and foods like vitamin Bs and vitamin C and vitamin D. So she was treating me to be able to tolerate those. 

00:17:33 Kimberly: And now this treatment is not something you take internally. It's an energetic treatment through acupuncture. This was the key, like I was no longer giving myself supplements. I was no longer taking treatments or protocols like internally because my body wasn't tolerating any of that. So everything I was doing was stuff that my system didn't have to like metabolize and methylate. So I was doing that, and then I was seeing different energy work practitioners, I was practicing yoga, which I had been practicing for years prior to this on and off in different forms, and meditation. And so those were, there were a few other things, but in combination with the brain retreating and the breathwork and the cold therapy, those were the other things I was doing. So it wasn't just one thing by far, just the three things by far. It was many things. So it was supporting my system in those ways while doing the brain retraining and the other things. 

00:18:23 Kimberly: So it was 16 months after I got the stem cells and I started the brain retraining just a couple months, like after one of the 100 days, well, it's like after the stem cells, you know. So I was doing the brain retraining for like over a year before the key turning point for me was when I felt like I could actually get in the car and try to drive down the street. I'd been like doing my rounds, my brain returning rounds, lying on the floor, like imagining myself holding the steering wheel, seeing myself in the car. I then even got in the car and would sit in the garage and imagine myself driving down the road and like, you know, seeing everything. Because my brain processing prior to that had been so slow that my tunnel vision had gotten so bad that the reason I had stopped driving a few years before that was because I could only see the bumper of the car in front of me and the center lane line on the road. And it freaked me out. And I was like, oh my god, I can't. I can't drive. I was already having trouble just getting to the store to do that. I was like, this is absolutely not good. not safe anymore. 

00:19:22 Kimberly: So that was like a big thing for me was driving and getting that liberation back to be able to like take myself to the store at a doctor's appointment or somewhere fun. God, even at that point, that was like unfathomable to be like, oh, I'm just going somewhere because it's fun. You know, I just want to go somewhere. So long-winded answer to your question is it was like a progression over those 16-ish months, you know, after the stem cells and, you know, after restarting the brain retraining again, that it was October of 2019 that I got in the car and started driving. And then from that point in October of 2019, there was a whole layers and layers beyond that of things that I still was going through because it was the last, very last thing was December 2020, I added dairy back into my diet. So that was like the last thing that I was really experiencing a response to. So I was like, it was the most terrifying thing to add back in. So that key moment of December of 2020, I think it was the end of 2020, was wow. Something has really, really shifted. Like I'm not scared. I'm not needing to read ingredients and like anything anymore. I'm just living life. Like I'm not reacting to anything anymore. There's quite a timeline. So 2020, you know, from 2018 to 2020, that's, you know, it was over two years.

00:20:44 Chazmith: And you were consistently retraining that whole time?

00:20:47 Kimberly: I was consistently retraining in the format of DNRS for like that up until like October of 2019. But I did so many different variations of it and like made it into my own thing. Then 2021, so it was three years. It was 2021 that I added the dairy back in, because 2020 I was doing a bunch of delivery services that year. Yeah, so that was part of my reign of training was like getting back in stores, getting used to being around people, getting my nervous system used to like being in a car, being in a store, talking to strangers. Using language again, you know, just like basic things. It was like completely retraining in way more applicable ways. And I challenged myself in October of 2019 to do something that scares me every single day. And I did that for like two years. 

00:21:36 Kimberly: And at that point, driving myself to the grocery store was still something that felt very scary, you know? Or like making a phone call to a friend I hadn't talked to in a while, you know? It was like small things that were huge things for me at that point in time. Even walking to the mailbox some days because I had like agoraphobia after being so sensory process sensitive that I was scared to leave the house because I was, for one, scared I'd run into a neighbor and they would try to talk to me and then I wouldn't understand what they were saying and it would be super embarrassing. And yeah, there were so many things. So the little tiny things that I did that scared me was challenging.

00:22:16 Chazmith: What are some of the ways that you kind of manipulated or shifted your practice, your brain retraining practice from the traditional format for anyone who's listening who maybe they struggle with the traditional format and they need some ideas to help them really refine it and make it their own?

00:22:35 Kimberly: Yeah, one thing is I'm personally a very good visualizer. Visualization doesn't come, like if I say visualize a purple mountain with a pink elephant on it, you know, like some people like immediately can get that image in their head. Some people it takes a little bit more effort and some people like do not see it at all. That's just not the way their brain works. So knowing your learning, like style and the way that your brain works with, like do you hear if I tell you to hear a song like can you hear the song playing in your head or if I say can you hear your mom's voice or, you know, somebody's voice in your head? But you know, like if you can hear that, those are ways to first know like, okay, how does my brain work and what is my learning style? 

00:23:14 Kimberly: And then you can kind of play around with that from there because some people that you can like record yourself, if you're an audio person and like hearing, like it in your head is more beneficial versus visuals. then you can record yourself saying your futurizations and you can listen to those instead of laying down and trying to visualize and picture them because some people it's just not going to be a possibility or it's going to just take way more effort. If you know that you're a great visualizer, then spending more time doing futurizations is an awesome way to do it. Another thing is just getting the nervous system in your training zone, like finding things that are actually fun. So like, if getting outside and being in the wind is something that's like challenging at the moment, you know, if this is where you're at and like, I'm going to step outside and, you know, put my feet in the grass, if that's your goal that you're going to do every day for like five to 15 minutes or whatever it is, use that as your training zone. 

00:24:08 Kimberly: So it's actually like a practical thing, like I'm getting outside, I'm getting sun, I'm getting fresh air, I'm getting ion charged from the ground from being barefoot on the grass or whatever it is. So using more practical skills to, or you know, practices, you know, that aren't necessarily just like for DNRS, it's like stop, stop, stop. And like, you know, you do this little, like kind of round thing, and it's very robotic. I think it's a great platform to learn it and understand how it works. But it gets boring after a while. At least it was for me. And that's what I hear from other people, too. It's like, it needs something else. There needs to be more involved here. So you can use your training zone. You can use your brand new training. It's really like pushing yourself, knowing that when your thoughts come up that aren't benefiting you, that you switch them to something else. So like with cold therapy, you know, like getting in the pool and changing that mindset around thing and allowing yourself to be in that space. Like, you know, that's like a way that you can use your brain training in those moments, too.

00:25:09 Chazmith: Okay, thank you. Speaking of cold therapy, so for many people, cold therapy can actually really put you into a sympathetic state. And there's a lot of people who are like, I don't know, let's say nervous system regulation coaches and so on that say that cold therapy is not for everybody, or it's not necessarily for everybody all the time. Like you need to be at a certain place and have a certain capacity to be able to handle it. So what was some indicators for you that you felt confident that you were, one, ready to do cold therapy, and what about cold therapy drew you in? What were you drawn to regarding it, and why did you want to do it?

00:25:51 Kimberly: I had started following Wim Hof and listening to his stories, and this was pretty early on. He wasn't as well-known at the time. And I was just fascinated because I didn't know anybody personally that was doing it. And I saw these people who had Lyme disease or other various different things that they were completely healing from using cold therapy. I was heat intolerant, so I had PoTS. And I also did have Raynaud's on and off many times. So I was cognizant of being very sensitive to even, like clothing touching my skin. Like I wasn't definitely not able to wear jeans at that time. But I just told myself that I was just going to get in and do it. So I had just gotten into this really firm, strong mindset that I'm just going to get in there and do it. So when I started, I would put my suit on and I'd like dip into the deep end of the pool and I would just get up to my hips and I was like, you know, just try to hold it for like 15 to 45 seconds and then I would get out. 

00:26:53 Kimberly: But there's other ways that you could do this like since then that, you know, you can work your way into it. So one is putting your hands in cold water, which was something that I did do as well. Was I was just sitting there with my hand up but that's almost worse than getting, like the whole body in it for me. Like I feel like you just get in this whole immersion and your mind just kind of goes off but when my hands are just in the water it feels intense but that is a way that a lot of people are kind of bridging that gap. Another thing is getting your face in a cold bowl of water. Now this one I think is the most practical use and I think, like anybody could use this. If you're ever feeling like you're just can't get out of your loop thoughts, you're just not feeling well, like putting your face in cold water completely changes that. It can even, you have to decide this for yourself, but it can even help to get out of like a panic attack moment. Put your face in the cold water, like any cold water therapy shocks you. out of the pattern loads of behavior that are going on, whether that's thought patterns, or whether that's neurological patterns, or whether that's hormonal patterns, your body is saying like, wait a minute, what is happening? 

00:27:54 Kimberly: I have to survive right now. I can't keep doing these patterns that I was doing before. I am here now in cold water. We need to figure out some other processes. We need to burn glucose very fast. Your body starts burning the brown fat and like you start heating up your core, your breath changes, your eyes open up, you know, like every single part of your body, your vascular system starts to like get narrower, you know, your muscles come in closer to your body. Every single part of your body is shifting in that moment and your mind is shifting in that moment. So you have an opportunity to kind of change where you were just a few seconds before that into an entirely different place. And you create different hormones in that moment as well. So the endorphins and the dopamine that you get after doing that is super strong. 

00:28:40 Kimberly: So to answer your question about like, who's ready for this, you know, like when is the safe time to do it? I think it's entirely individual and there's so many different ways to get into it. Definitely like talking to your practitioners, like talking to yourself and your intuition and what you feel like is if it feels like it's a fit for you. But I know that myself, I was still going through a lot of intense symptoms at the time that I started it. And I've seen other people do that, too. So. I think it's just using your own discretion and where you're at, you know, mentally and physically. But the mental part of it is so huge.

00:29:13 Chazmith: That's amazing. So you are actually suggesting we use this cold therapy as a pattern interrupt, a form of actually interrupting a pattern.

00:29:24 Kimberly: Yes. So I use breathwork and cold therapy to interrupt those. And that was a game changer for me. That's why when I say like the three of them, I almost can't separate them because I use them together. So even for the breathwork, I was, one of the examples I have is I was really highly sensitive to tomatoes. Like I would break, my mouth would start peeling instantly on contact. I would get a rash all the way around my mouth. It was like an instant reaction and it just started itching like crazy. So tomatoes were like something I ate a lot of. And so with leaky gut, you know, like that was something that ended up being one of my first allergies to it. So I'll explain a little bit the leaky gut connection just to explain, like further what I was kind of doing with this. 

00:30:08 Kimberly: So for me and for a lot of people, leaky gut is like when the intestinal walls get, like kind of holey. So they get irritated, the lining starts to kind of break away and basically molecules of food that are too big to typically go through the holes in the intestinal walls are now going through the holes in the intestinal walls. And so the immune system, the white blood cells are going, wait a minute, there's something foreign in here that we can't do anything with because this molecule of food is too big to actually use cellularly to get the nutrients out of it. So the white blood cells come and eat them up. And the white blood cells now say, wait a minute, this tomato or whatever the food is, is now like an invader in the body. It's something that we can't do anything with. And so we need to attack it. So now you have a histamine response to these foods. And so you end up like now not just reacting to the big molecules of foods that are coming through, but the tiny molecules of foods that your body can actually do something with. 

00:30:59 Kimberly: Like my leaky gut had gotten so bad that I was down to eating like 10 different foods like at the at my lowest weight lowest point in many ways and then I was like, okay, I'm gonna use the breathwork to alkalize my body so an alkalosis a respiratory alkalosis so bringing in a ton of oxygen into the body and allowing the body to go into a state of shock similar to the cold therapy the body is having like you're intentionally putting your body into alkalosis, so it's like you're using this as a tool. So I would put myself into the respiratory alkalosis after taking in 30 big breaths of like high oxygen breaths of air and then hold my breath and in this moment my body was in respiratory alkalosis shock. So bringing in too much oxygen that the body can't do anything with that much oxygen and not enough carbon dioxide. 

00:31:50 Kimberly: And so in that moment, need to survive just like I was in the water. So it's like, wait a minute, these patterns of behavior, the hormone releases, the immune system responses, the patterns of thoughts in the head could no longer continue anymore. So the pattern interrupter there was the breathwork and then so I would do a couple rounds of breathwork and this was at a point where my histamine responses weren't as intense as they were earlier on so like I was not responding to things as strongly and I did not start with tomatoes, with some other foods that I wasn't as sensitive to. But my key factor day was like, oh, my God, I'm going to try this with tomatoes. And so I did like a couple rounds of breath work, took a bite of tomato, and then immediately did another round of breath work so that my system was going into that learned state of shocking. I had trained my body so much now with this alkalosis breathing and that pattern interruption with the futurizations and the visualizations and re-changing the visuals that I was giving my body. So now I'm saying, my body, the tomatoes are going in, my body's taking all the nutrients out of the tomatoes that it can use, and it's beautifully creating new cells within my system, and then I expel the waste that I can't use. So I would use the visualizations and the futurizations along with the breathwork and that pattern interruption.

00:33:09 Chazmith: Okay. Well, two-part question. One, when you did this, were you just doing true Wim Hof where you did the 30 inhale, exhale, and then you held your breath on the exhalation, like no air in your system, like how you do in Wim Hof? Two, how did you come up with this? Like obviously Wim Hof came up with the breath, but how did you connect the dots? or where did you learn from that you could put these together? How did you connect the dots that this breath work could help you to retrain around these histamine responses?

00:33:42 Kimberly: So I've always done it with a retention. So I've personally always held the breath in. That's just something I've always done. I don't know why. It just seems to work better for me that way. But I mean, I guess it could be done either way. And I think it was just learning the deep science behind it and how alkalosis breathing works and seeing that like the patterns and just hearing him describe like how the body is working and like reading up on how alkalosis, you know, respiratory alkalosis works. And I was just kind of like connected the dots and was like, well, I can use this. It's changing everything. It's changing my DNA. It's changing my you know, the acidity in the body, it's getting more alkaline, you know, and all these things. 

00:34:27 Kimberly: So I kind of saw things on a pH scale. So the body gets super acidic, you know, when we have pathogens in our body. So the pathogens stay in our system because our gut is acidic, usually is like the first thing. Our blood becomes acidic, all of our tissues start becoming acidic, and we start, you know, having more acidic emotions coming through, which are chemical releases within the body. And we start harboring these things in our gut, which then like kind of spread out to the rest of our bodies. So it stays in this acidic state. That's why, in my mind, a lot of these diseases and, you know, pathogens like stay in the system because it's acidic. So if we create more of like going towards like a neutral on the pH scale around seven, if we're aiming towards that, and we're doing like this respiratory alkalosis, that allows for the body to create a different environment, a different pH balance. 

00:35:21 Kimberly: So if we're moving from an acidic to an alkaline state, I would visualize that the pathogens could not survive as it was moving to that like neutral seven, you know, that they could no longer be in there, the immune system was functioning, the DNA that is serving us is actually turning back on. So I was not born with any of the things that I was experiencing. Any of these diagnoses, I wasn't born with them. So the DNA codes that were benefiting me were turned on. But then we all have bits of DNA codes that don't benefit us and those get turned on and the other ones get, the good ones get turned, the beneficial ones get turned off when our body gets acidic. So I was seeing it as like, okay, my body's getting acidic. So there's this alkalosis breathing tool that I now have. So I'm gonna create like this pH seven here and allow my body to like return back, allow my DNA to return back to like a beneficial like code again. And so that's just kind of how I saw it, I guess.

00:36:22 Chazmith: That's so cool. So basically, you were working with lowering the acidity in your body in multiple ways because you were doing it through breath work, but you're also doing it through mindset shifts because obviously stress also creates an acidic environment internally. So the more that you're reducing your stress and changing your thoughts and thinking patterns and doing your brain retraining, the more that you're also helping with that acidity. So you were really just like, hey, let me just address this from multiple angles.

00:36:53 Kimberly: Yes. Yes. Yeah. And there's so many ways that our body becomes acidic, you know, and so I started just seeing things on like a pH scale.

00:37:04 Chazmith: Okay. And how did you come up with this idea to use cold therapy as a pattern interrupt? Did you learn that somewhere or is that something that you just intuited as well?

00:37:13 Kimberly: Yeah, I guess I just through the experience of it, you know, was just like, well, I guess, you know, they talk about your mindset is going to shift as you do this on a regular basis. And so like, you're gonna your mindset is going to get stronger, like, it's still going to be cold, but you're not going to go in the water screaming, or you're not going to go in with panic anymore, like you're going to learn to calm your nervous system down with your mind, like as you go into it. And so I just was kind of like, okay, well, like, this is interrupting the pattern, because like, when you get into that cold water, like you're in the cold water, like you are there in that moment, like you're not thinking of the laundry list, the things you have to do, you know, or like an argument you had with somebody. You're like, I'm in cold water right now. I just need to be here and breathe through it. And there's no other option at the moment.

00:38:04 Chazmith: Yeah, no, that's so neat because I've definitely learned how you can use cold water to be able to then, like you said, use your mind to be mindful of your breath and calm your breathing down and bring your nervous system to a state of calm while under this duress, which some people have this theory that it teaches you how to be able to do hard things like build resilience because if I can do this and it's really hard, I can also go through some other hard stressor in my life and have that mindful capacity to control my breathing and remain calm. So I've always learned that, but I just love this idea of using it as a pattern interrupt on this thinking from a more brain retraining perspective, having a cold bowl of water and you have like a say some type of intrusive thought that no matter how many times you try to interrupt it in other ways like stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, stop, and it's not stopping and you're like okay I'm gonna dip my head in cold water and then it goes away finally because you're just like holy shit this is cold.

00:39:09 Chazmith: I love it. It's so fun. Yeah. So I've been taking cold showers for every day, I would say 99% of the days for months now. So I have to admit that I do take them outdoors and it's hot in Florida. So, you know, there are days that it's so hot that it actually feels incredibly refreshing. It doesn't have the same intensity factor. But we've definitely had some cooler days or days where maybe I don't sit outside first and get like myself all heated. and it feels really cold. But it's funny because the days that I'm really hesitant and almost want to talk myself out of it, when I do it and I turn the cold on, initially it is so freaking cold. But within a minute, it's comfortable. I'm actually like, oh, this is refreshing. Oh, this feels good. It just, I miss it when I don't get it. But I have to say that those hard days get like letting it go down on my face is the hardest part. Like I get my body and my back and my arms and I'm like, okay, FaceTime and it's like, oh, the face is definitely the hardest. But I would say that the scalp, when I actually want to get my hair wet, that's the most refreshing.

00:40:19 Kimberly: Yeah. The hair, like there's something about like getting the full body like submersion, which like actually when I was doing cold therapy in lake Tahoe, I was wearing a beanie and I wouldn't get my hair wet, but a lot of the times it was like freezing temperatures. So I also didn't want my hair to actually freeze. So there was that as well, but I know like a lot of people do they like dunk their head in like no matter how cold it is. So I would usually opt not to in those temperatures get like wet. 

00:40:47 Chazmith: Yeah. I wouldn't do it in cold either. I'm doing it on like 80 degree days where the sun's shining and it's like, oh, this is... But I have noticed that if you do have a heat sensitivity, for whatever reason, I've noticed that the cold showers have been really supportive.

00:41:05 Kimberly: Oh. They've helped with your heat intolerance in general?

00:41:09 Chazmith: I think so. And I'm pretty confident that they're going to help with my cold days not feeling so cold. I'm aiming for that. By the wintertime on cold days, it's not going to be as cold because–  

00:41:19 Kimberly: Well, it's true. 

00:41:20 Chazmith: Yeah, right. And I used to be such a cold person. And I would shiver really easy. But even when we've had a couple really cold days, or I go into a store that's ultra air conditioned, I've noticed that my initial reaction is to start shivering, but once I'm aware of it, I can actually stop it.

00:41:38 Kimberly: Yeah. And that's where you start to gain control over your body. Because I think in our modern world and like, listen to your doctor and all this stuff, a lot of our power has been taken away. And then, like, we also are in very controlled environments for, like, most of the time. Like, we go from an air-conditioned or heated car to an air-conditioned or heated house to an air-conditioned or heated work environment or a store. You know, it's like, we are, for the majority of the time, like, in a controlled, like, temperature environment and also air conditioning in itself is blowing cold air and that can really disrupt the nervous system, too. But then when we learn that we can take back that power and really like train our nervous system, our cells, our body to like adapt and like respond differently to like our environments and that was heavily like I experienced this to extreme degree. 

00:42:30 Kimberly: Because when I moved to Tahoe in spring of 2021 to become a raft guide, it was still snowing and I was, I had not had much outdoor experience, but being that I had just done cold therapy every day for a year and a half, I was used to being in cold water and having my body in those experiences. So here I am rafting in the snow and my body was not used to this experience at all. Nice to be outdoors and everything and I was able to use that mindset and like the way that my body had learned to respond to cold and heat. And the brain retraining to be like, I can get through this, like this, I have all the power. Because you get the thing is with the brain retraining, you keep gaining more experiences to prove how freaking strong you are. 

00:43:21 Kimberly: So it's like, I'm a huge, like, advocate of improvement tracking. So like tracking your little tiny improvements as you go, because like in the beginning, they're very small. So like mine were so small that I almost wasn't even noticing them. And I had to track them and say like, okay, I'm seeing this. I was able to listen to music for five minutes today. I could watch a video at a brighter screen, like level, you know, like I was able to have a conversation with somebody for 20 minutes, you know, there was little tiny incremental things that were happening and then they got bigger and bigger and bigger. So by the time that I had gone to Tahoe and was like whitewater rafting and in that environment, I was like, I did this whole therapy for a year and a half. I have like the proof, like I've put myself through this and it gets stronger and it just builds and it builds and it builds. 

00:44:08 Kimberly: And I like had the PoTS like you did, too. And so I really think that doing the cold therapy like was, you know, it's exercising your vascular system, it's exercising your muscles, it's exercising your mind. Just so you're becoming, even though it's cold, you're training your body that it doesn't need to be responsive because your body basically thinks that it's protecting you when it's heat sensitive or cold sensitive, it's like saying like, oh wait, this is like a danger. Like I shouldn't, I like, I need to do something. So when you're doing cold therapy, you know, you're able to like retrain your system and say like, no, wait, this isn't dangerous. Like, you know, like look, we're in a controlled environment. We're choosing to deal with it. It's like, that's the thing is you have the power, you're giving yourself the power back.

00:44:51 Chazmith: Yeah, that's so true. You know, I remember that during our last conversation, you talked about this raft, this big move in this rafting job, but I feel like it was like a really fun story. So can you share that with us?

00:45:05 Kimberly: Yeah, so this was a continuation of my brainer training, actually. So I like, as I was saying earlier, I realized how much being around water and big trees was so important to me and my body. And so I was like, okay, I'm living in like I'm living in the city, like kind of suburb city situation. Like, I really want to be in nature more. So I was looking for something outdoors. And then I was just kind of looking on Craigslist, I was looking at all these jobs, I was trying to find something outdoors and I saw an ad that said, become a whitewater raft guide, no experience necessary. So I called up the person, they're like, yeah, you can like, come on, we'd love to have you. So I just, I didn't know anything about it. Like, I like watched a bunch of YouTube videos on like how to read water and like gear. I had never really even been camping. So like, I was just trying to like, understand gear I needed or like what do you even do when you're outside in the wilderness. So like I was using all of that and like gaining all this knowledge and that and like I actually bought a PFD or like a life vest and I put it on I was standing in the mirror and I was like pretending that I was telling like the people that were in my boat like what to do and just by like what I had watched on YouTube videos and everything like that. So it was using the brain retraining in those forms, like watching myself in the mirror and seeing myself in the gear that I bought, you know, to like visualize myself there. So even before I moved, I was doing that. 

00:46:25 Kimberly: And then I moved up there and I just had to be in it. It was just kind of like at the whim of, okay, this is the experience, you know, and now I'm here. And so I was renting a room when I first moved there and then I ended up living on the property of the raft guide company and I was living in a school bus for a while and then I bought like a trailer and I was living in a trailer and they put little wood burning stove into my trailer, a little cubic mini and it was just such a like an amazing experience. I was living with all of these raft guides on the property and so I was fully immersed in the non-healing world, which was that I absolutely needed because that's that, like, you can't heal in the environment that you got sick in. And now that can mean a million different things. 

00:47:11 Kimberly: Not everybody can go and be a whitewater raft guide or go and, you know, move to an entirely different city and be away from everybody and everything they know. But there's various different forms of that. So I was in this environment where, you know, people were not being super health conscious, like by any means, you know, eating a lot of processed foods. And I mean, there was like a balance to it because we were outdoors, we were very active and all that kind of stuff. But, you know, I wasn't consciously thinking about all that. So I wasn't doing the brain training at this point. I would still do yoga here and there. I'd still do kundalini here and there and my meditations. But for the most part, I was just fully in that experience. 

00:47:51 Kimberl: And like it was so a you need to be in the moment, especially during those first two weeks when we had our guide school training and we were every single day like out there for the full day. And so I just had to be in the experience, in the present, in the now. And so that helped me to continue that brain retraining and to not be thinking about supplements and routines and everything else because no, I was in an entirely different world.

00:48:18 Chazmith: That is so awesome. And how long did you do that for?

00:48:20 Kimberly: I did it for two seasons. So two summer seasons and then a lot of yeah and then a lot of fun rafting like through that through the winter as well. So yeah.

00:48:33 Chazmith: Okay. And you were pretty much just, like, not really immersed in the healing world at that time. You were just kind of in the living world.

00:48:42 Kimberly: Yes. Yeah. Especially for, like, that first part of the first season. I did end up starting, like, my business legitimately. And, like, I had a couple other jobs. And then I, like, started to, like, okay, I want to be more into the health consciousness side of things again. And, like, I wanted, like, sharing my story and all that kind of stuff. So it was, like, probably like a good six months that, like I really didn't. Like I was almost like turned off by like anything like health and wellness related. I just needed to be like just a human just living, you know, just experiencing life. But then I also just kept getting this calling that like I want to share my story, I want other people to know that you can be in a place where you think you're gonna die and like that there's no way out of this, to like be able to come become a whitewater raft guide you know and so the call was like very strong and so within that like six months to a year after moving there like I like started getting into it and then I led like cold plunging groups like in the lake you know and it was like so it was just different versions of what it was, you know. Like the healing world, it was just a, you know, adaptation and an evolution.

00:49:49 Chazmith: That's awesome. Yeah. Now looking back in hindsight, do you feel like that was an essential part of your healing to take a step away from the community and to take a dive into this whole other realm? Because as I hear you talk about this, to me what that sounds like is a way to really peel away from this old identity or like I imagine like just peeling apart from this old illness identity, this old chronic sickness identity. And I wonder, because it is a natural, in a sense, progression to have illness and then almost stay in the community because it's kind of like the glue that in a sense keeps you committed and you want to give back, like you said. But I know for myself, even, I've been feeling a strong pull to take a step away from everything, healing, chronic illness community to really disengage from that identity, to really step into life where everybody else is just living and thriving, so that I can take on that identity of well-being, of healing, of thriving and not be so wrapped up in whatever residual feeling or identity around my illness, old illnesses still might exist or coexist within me somewhere. Does that make sense?

00:51:02 Kimberly: Totally. I like 100% feel that. I mean it's, life's about balance, right? So like, if we've been in a state of severe chronic illness, and that's what the world like, it's just like, how do I survive through the day? And like, what treatment should I do next? And what doctor should I call? And what do I do? And it's this constant worry. And like, this is where life is for so long, it might need to be thrown to the other side. And like, you might need to be like, immersed in something different for a while, like to get those vibrations of being in those other experiences. And not hearing the words and the phrases and seeing the things that remind you of that. But then it's like, okay, there's the two polar sides here. And then now it's like, where do I find a nice medium where I can oscillate here in the middle and feel out what feels right to me at different times?

00:51:53 Kimberly: Because I still do this in my posting and everything. I'll be like, I have a ton of creative energy. I really am feeling like I want to share a bunch of stuff right now. I love talking to people. That's what I'm doing. That's my business now. But then there's moments where I step away from that and I'm like, okay, I just need a moment to like not post as much and not commune and like talk to people as much and kind of recharge, you know, and get that recharge back of feeling like life force, you know, and everything and then go back to it. So it's like a constant thing I've noticed like every few weeks that kind of happens is that I noticed that I'm really into, oh, I have all this energy and I can like gain this and then I need a recharge. 

00:52:33 Kimberly: I mean, that's how we work, you know, seasonally, like winter is like more downtime and more inwardness and being more cozy and like nurturing yourself in different ways. And summer is kind of more explosive and get out, you know, so like we have that natural rhythm of life that is constantly changing and we have to recharge like it's necessary, you know? Like and I think anybody that's gone through an extreme experience of like chronic illness is very hyper aware of how things affect them. And I, for sure, I'm like, I know when I need to say yes and no to things. So I know when something's a yes for me and I know when something is like maybe another time kind of thing for me. And making sure that I have those moments of recharge and just listening to what that means for me at the moment.

00:53:17 Chazmith: Yeah. So good. So good. Oh, my gosh, I want to ask you like 100 more questions, but we've already done an hour. I can't believe how fast this has flown by. I guess it flies by when you're not getting kicked off the internet like 20 times. Okay, out of curiosity, just for everyone who's listening, do you have any kind of, because you've been well for quite a while now, do you have any kind of daily self-care routines or rituals that you follow still to this day to support you to maintain your well-being?

00:53:48 Kimberly: Yeah, so it switches constantly. Again, like that's the whole balance thing. So, like I kind of listen into like what it is that I need. But the consistent is intuitive eating. So it's like listening to what my body needs now and giving myself like whatever it's craving or whether wise I need more heavy foods or lighter foods. The other thing is a morning routine for me. And that can look like entirely different depending on what it is that I'm doing. but I allow myself whatever time I need to get up to give myself about an hour to two hours in the morning. And that can look like doing kundalini yoga, that can look like doing stretching, that can look like doing a facial steam, which is something that I've been into recently a lot. That can look like breath work, that can look like cold therapy. It changes based on what it is that I'm doing. And getting out in nature is like another thing, too. 

00:54:36 Kimberly: And like recently, like every like two or three weeks I go to the beach because I live about like an hour and like 15 minutes away from the beach. So I like get out there and go to the beach. And that's something that like really recharges me. I did that yesterday with a friend and it was wonderful to just get out and like recharge or just sometimes getting out and sitting under a tree is something that's like recharging for me. So listening to what it is that I need at the moment and then just allowing myself to nurture myself in that way. Also taking baths, taking hot baths like to sweat is something that I do on a regular basis still for detox and also coffee enemas. So coffee enemas, on and off for detox just kind of when I feel them. I didn't do them for a very long time and to me it was something that kind of represented being sick and so I was kind of like, I don't really want to do those, you know. And then I was like, oh, it'd be so interesting to see how my body actually feels with them when I don't need them to survive. But now, like, I can just use them to, like, kind of give myself a boost, you know? So that's those are two other things that I do on a pretty regular basis.

00:55:39 Chazmith: Awesome. And if you could only share one message for the rest of your life with the whole wide world, what message would you spend your life sharing?

00:55:46 Kimberly: Only little questions here. It would be that you absolutely have the power to do anything that you want to create in your life. And if that's healing, if you're working towards healing yourself, you are so incredibly strong and you have everything within you to bring yourself out of a place that is non-beneficial to you, to a place where you are thriving. I think that's the biggest key, is that people just do not realize how incredibly powerful they are. Like, you are so freaking powerful. It took me a long time to realize that, and I still have my moments where I'm like, ah, you know, and I have to bring myself back, use my brainwave training, use my thought processing, and like remember, you know, remember myself at that soul level and how incredibly powerful we are.

00:56:34 Chazmith: Yeah. Yeah. Thank you. And how can people connect with you?

00:56:38 Kimberly: Yeah, so I do wellness coaching and I do energy work specializing in brain retraining and overcoming chronic illness. So I do have a website, kimberlyharter.com. You can also follow me on Instagram or YouTube at Kimber's New Frequency, or you can reach out to me at yourwellness@kimberlyharter.com. I'd love to talk to you or you can comment in my videos on YouTube. There's many different ways that we can get in touch. So yeah, please reach out if you're feeling any resonance with anything here.

00:57:08 Chazmith: Fantastic. Yay. I'm so glad we got to do this again. Thank you. Thank you for taking your time, a second time to do this to help me share this message without rattling my brain trying to put all those different files together. I really appreciate you. It was fun. It was so fun despite the technical errors last time to talk with you and it was even more fun to get to talk to you today uninterrupted.

00:57:37 Kimberly: Well, thank you so much for having me. I really appreciate it. And thank you for having this platform to share these stories. That's so huge as like recovery stories were so big for me and allowing myself to believe that I could get better. That was something I watched on a regular basis. That was actually part of my brain retraining was watching recovery videos. So the fact that you do this and you have this platform is amazing. And like, thank you for putting this out there.

00:58:03 Chazmith: Thank you. Every episode that you tune into, my hope is that you feel inspired in some way or that you learned something insightful or practical to implement into your healing experience. Don't forget to tune in to Instagram for our weekly challenges where we will focus on a different theme every month and until next time, make this week great!